I am contemplating more fully a Monsterhearts MU.

I am contemplating more fully a Monsterhearts MU.

I am contemplating more fully a Monsterhearts MU. I think I would want a few more skins that are “mundane” in character, like the Mortal and the Queen — I think the contrast is helpful, especially when player interaction will be doing some of the heavy lifting.

I haven’t sat down to write skins, but I am considering maybe some sort of Jock skin, some sort of Rich Kid skin, and maybe some sort of Outsider skin.

The Jock might be designed to tell stories about how sometimes, being physically strong just isn’t enough.

The Rich Kid (maybe “The Entitled”) might have some move that gives her access to wealth — and much like the Jock, be designed for stories about how mortal wealth isn’t enough.

The Outsider I imagine as the geek or goth or pagan — the outcast — and they might have some moves and stories about learning the secrets.

I’m not sure, though. What do you all think?

17 thoughts on “I am contemplating more fully a Monsterhearts MU.”

  1. I actually have a few work ups for several of these concepts.

    For the Jock, I have this mock up of “The Star” which works as any kind of popular kid. Nothing in the skin is inherently supernatural.

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Ua2Y-UbGmva_IKT9O5z8sJNp4OqusoZk3Wn4pL6g-tg/edit?usp=sharing

    The Outsider was the original name for what I eventually named “The Alien” which was to represent the Aliens a la old show Roswell or the recent show Star-Crossed, both of which felt very Monsterhearts to me personally.

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1D7j7IUMXhAjIya8mkMfxeEvBmvpkEi_UM86kdjLYn5M/edit?usp=sharing

    It is technically a supernatural skin but so can be the Queen who can be a literal hive mind. Really I see making a mundane skin more about move choices and the narrative description of a character. Is your werewolf really a shapeshifting creature or a kid with severe anger issues? After all the real reason MH works well is because classic Horror monsters were always just exaggerated human traits.

    Upon rereading your thoughts, I think I might want to make a suggestion that if you do make these skins you should keep in mind more of what makes these people “monsters” because even the mortal is a “monster” even as a purely mundane character. Your descriptions seems to ride on what makes these people tragic (Fame/Money not being enough) but not what makes them the same kind of horrible person that ever other skin is. Yes the mortal can be tragic but the mortal is also doing it to themselves and they usually get other people in trouble instead of themselves. that makes them just as much a monster, if not more.

    Whatever you do, if you are looking to hack some of your own skins I hope this helps.

  2. I feel that the best Skins are ones that use the monster/supernatural element as a metaphor for some teenage issue. I had a happy accident when I realized The Oni I was making was a Skin about bullying. I struggled with The Kitsune until I made it a metaphor for compulsive lying.

    So while you can make great Skins about a character archetype, I think the best ones are an even mix of archetype AND issue.

  3. I agree. And I don’t think tabletop Monsterhearts would need more mundane skins — but a MU has some different narrative pressures, and so I think you want a slightly wider range of mundane possibilities. One of the things about all of the skins is that they emphasize questions about being “different”. In a tabletop game, the MC emphasizes that by playing the whole world, but there tends to be more weight on player interaction on a MU which means that more “foil” skins are useful, I think.

  4. I guess part of this is perhaps unfamiliarity with what you are meaning by MU. Usually when I see MU in relation to roleplaying games it’s followed with a D for Multi User Dungeon or SH for Multi-User Shared Habitiat/Hallucination/Hack.I suppose it could be “Multiplayer Universe”…

    But anyway, even in the table top game interactions are paramount and basically every character would be a “foil” to others, if by Foil you mean the literary kind not the aluminum kind

    Jokes aside, and continuing on the assumption that the MU is somewhat related to the concepts discussed in the first paragraph I don’t think having enforced “mundane” options would be necessary. In most of the MH games I have played in characters naturally became foils for one another… even full out antagonists. If someone wants to play a more mundane character, again I hold that most of the skins can be made fairly mundane by simply not choosing certain moves.

  5. Wow lots of stuff relevant to what I’m doing here.

    Second Skins has the Neighbor which sounds like a nice alternative mundane with its own take on issues but it isn’t out yet.

    I actually think myth as metaphor is actually a bit overdone and cliche. A good skin should have some room for interpretation but some are more mundane or magical than others. The Queen is intentionally ambiguous and the Werewolf particularly flexible (do they change in their mind? or are they are Wearbear? just crazy?). One of my favorite twists was seeing a Sasquatch (another Second Skins skin and about as ambiguous as the Queen from what I recall) who was neither magic nor mundane but a cloned neanderthal and rather skeptical of the supernatural.

    What a good skin needs isn’t so much a metaphor but a way to intertwine the “monster” and the “issue”. The Werewolf actually doesn’t work for all werewolves, if you are more controlled or reluctant you might be better off as a Beast (http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/155325/Skins-for-the-Skinless). The Oni is a great skin but I never saw it as a metaphor so much as a logical “issue” for the Oni to manifest. The Medusa is a good example of one where ‘metaphor’ isn’t really the approach, the deadly gazed serpent creature isn’t a metaphor for the medusa’s issues, it’s an association that comes from the mythology. Yet, it still ties the skin together for a variety of interpretations: you were unjustly blamed, transformed and now your self-righteousness and callousness make you part of the problem.

    I agree that skins need a “tie” of some kind to mix the archetype and the issue. I also agree they should be about what makes the character a “monster” more than what sort of tragic story they are for. The story emerges from the characters together, though a few Skins affect the whole game more than others.

    So for example, The Jock, sure maybe being strong isn’t enough, but what makes the Jock a (potential?) monster? Going off you idea using strength to solve all problems seems like a good base issue. So you design the Skin to give them enough strength to solve anything that force can solve but few tools for other problems and a Darkest Self that turns that strength to destructive use.

    I am working on two Skins relevant here.

    The Invader is an alien or somesuch but unlike the outsider alien mentioned above The Invader isn’t concerned with fitting in. The Skin is more about finding one’s place in the world and deciding who to trust. Their issue is power or the lack thereof, they are here to change the world but know little about it, their superiors give them the power to do so but little clue on the big picture. It’s about the strange mix of despair and idealism that tends to accompany the teenage years and the desire to bring a fresh approach combined with lack of independent resources, which to me seems more significant part of that period than the social drama a lot skins focus on.

    The umm, well I was originally going to call it Nosferatu but that’s becoming less and less appropriate. The Bogey is a possibility. This is my outsider skin and an ambiguous skin like the Queen, they are shunned for looking different or social awkwardness. The Skin is about the double edged nature of the status. Rumors are definetely an aspect of this Skin. People fear you like Boo Radley and you can use that to manipulate them, but doing so feeds into the lies they tell about you. This Skin does crave acceptance but also vengeance: If you can’t join them, maybe it’s time to beat them.

    So it’s less about mundane or not and more about what makes the character damaged and dangerous.

  6. I don’t think Monsterhearts works above 5 personalities (or without an MC following their principles.) Without a deep understanding of each character, you can play romantic dramas, and that’s okay, but there’s nothing stopping the Fae and the Werewolf from having a relatively healthy relationship. It’s the MC who asks provocative questions, pulls them apart, puts them together, that creates drama.

    And there are dozens of existing skins– just search the tabs here.

  7. It may be that it doesn’t work in a large number. I’m not sure I’m convinced of that yet, though — I think you can push at people in a lot of ways, and I think you can embrace co-MCing philosophies that can drive.

  8. I think it could work with a large number but there are some issues. For example the penalty for failing is generally the MC getting a hard move. You might be able to automate that a bit but without a lot of staff to watch small groups and make their lives interesting it may not work out well. NPCs just don’t work like PCs in MH so you need both represented.

    As for Skins focusing on being different. In the end I think that’s core, the PCs are unusual and inexperienced in MH. Don’t forget Skins can’t be interpreted in many ways and some mundane skins exist.

  9. Yeah, I think Misses will in some ways generate a sort of MC hold — folks report misses, and then we have hold to make future hard moves. Though sometimes, I think the consequences are apparent and something you can self adjudicate.

    In a physical fight, for instance, the consequence of a miss can often be something that doesn’t need an MC — but other times, we just delay and misdirect.

  10. I had a thought about MC holds and I think that could be a good idea… the question is how much the MC/Mods will shape the story vs how much is player driven content.

    perhaps it would be better to just assume instead that a failed roll gives the target of your roll a string or assesses a condition on the person who failed.

    I also had and idea that each MC/Mod could basically be a dark power for the infernal.

    But I do think this would require some MC interventions to set plots in motions to stir up drama. It coudl just be declaring it’s home coming and you will need to choose a homecoming king/Queen or class president or something

  11. Yes. I imagine an active and engaged MC, and I think actually that there are more tools in PbtA games for the MC to stir up plot even for people who don’t have great time overlaps. When I’ve run MUs in the past there has been a lot of plot.

  12. Well if you get this up and running I might have a long running fabulously deadpan choosen-hating chaos-feeding Ghoul character to add to the game, possibly with her bubbly then rip your face off Mortal lover/partner if interested

  13. Yeah, I have started to do some writing for it. I think it is going to be a high school/town that looks a lot like Neptune from Veronica Mars — I think that show did a good job of setting up teen drama, and then you can just add in monsters!

  14. If the goal is teen drama and keeping people alive, I’d say the Smallville RPG is the place to start. It does intricate character connections but the lethality is much, much lower than MH.

  15. Smallville is also much more complicated in the game mechanics than MH being a dice pool/aspect system where the number of dice you roll changes whether your character if following the aspect of the relationship or challenging it, thus lowering it’s total from there on out

    Most of it’s character connections come from drawing a relationship map which is both easily stolen and inserted into any game, and might be difficult to add in others at a later date.

    As for lethality, if that is an issue, that could be easily fixed by giving characters a version of “short rest for the wicked” (heck call it Long rest for the wicked”) where “killed” characters get out of the hospital and back into the game after a set amount of game time, and people who take Short rest themselves would effectively just have a much Shorter rest (for the wicked). But even then with the ability to buy off death twice and heal from other attentions makes MH much less lethal than most assume, of course it’s not as non lethal as a game where you can’t die unless you basically choose to, but very rarely have i seen MH players in my game successfully beat themselves and others to death, unless it was a final climatic battle.. then it’s glorious

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