Well, Hunter is done and has gone through it’s first review.
If available, I was hoping Andrew Medeiros, Tim Franzke, Aaron Friesen, and/or Bryan Hitchcock could have a quick glance over or tear it apart. We accept any feedback. As mentioned before, the feedback given so far has been beyond helpful in making this a better “product.” Werewolf would be lost without it. Also, I hope none of you mind, that I keep tagging you on these revision request. I only do so, as again because of the feedback given so far.
Slasher has been added after Orpheus from John Layton. It look so brutal, going to be fun for those evil games. I think he will be looking into a way to add Demon the Fallen, while I will be adding Changeling.
In doing so, like all things it will delay the end of the product, but we will by the end of this have 8 add-ons to Andrew Medeiros’s book. Plus, I know Andrew Medeiros has a few more surprises for us that I can add. At that point, I will still have to get a book printed through and sent off to those that have helped greatly.
Can you send me a link?
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1vAfokBManOfs96xyvhPB2q6P1lR3PrN1OGNmjkLoqk8/edit
Tim Franzke, you may have already had that link. The item list is in order from the Table of Contents on that page. It is quite a long document, one that will be getting a bit longer with Demon and Changeling.
going in there now!
and sorry for the harsh tone, there is just a lot of stuff that doesn’t agree with my design sentiments, especially about flat bonuses and restricting 6- results.
A lot of the move also just deal damage to yourself, out of all the possible things you could do, that is one of the least interesting.
When you look at Apocalypse World, there are 2-3 moves that define 6- results. All others are up to the MC and that is for a good reason.
and sorry if it comes up as to harsh or destructive, i am tired and a bit cranky.
Tim, don’t worry. Most of our first round is converting WW fiction to AW mechanics and a lot of that ends up jumbled. That’s why I need Aaron and yourself, to help weed some of that out. In the end there may be a compromise but it will end up a much better product, so again thank you.
Tim Franzke I just went through the feedback. A lot quite good. I see John Layton’s point about the destructive nature of the moves based upon WW fiction, but I will do something on what is the better alternative if there is one. Talk to John Layton, he has been quite appreciative of the feedback.
I think your base point is fair though. If the +’s add to the fiction, roll with it. If it hinder’s fiction, then it needs a revisit.
I will keep you up to date on when these done, if you want to take a look at the last two Organizations in Hunter after that.
John Layton, I would like to see some of the misses, unless directly about the fiction taken out …. leaving more to the MC.
It’s easy to say, “the MC can still make a move.” But I think any MC that watches you take damage and then also double dips and does something else will feel like an asshole.
I think, this will open up some of the fiction possibilities.
Again, not all, but SOME.
Things that say: on a 6-: directly mean that the MC doesn’t get to make a move; that’s why I was asking.
And there are cooler results to taking drugs then damage.
And it is a valid question.
So, something says “The chemicals taken for the advantage of “X Move” have backed fired causing an averse effect determined by the MC.”
After reviewing Orpheus, I am quite proud that I didn’t push strict Miss mechanics that much already.
Tim Franzke I also apologize if my replies felt cranky and whatnot, late nights were my only free time the last couple of days, and my view of how MCs can act is quite liberal. Plus, when I wrote these, the miss mechanics felt needed because as I said, you’re putting something potentially debilitating or deadly into your body in hope of getting an effect. The miss results felt fair to me and I know that as an MC, I could take it and turn it into my favor (and not always in a way that will screw the player), adding fiction and description to turn it less from a mechanic.
So something that causes a faint injury because it seeps into your skin could be described as pain in the area it was applied or like your blood is burning. This could be seen as distracting to the character and so he doesn’t notice something that he was trying to find. Things like that. And by the damage or the penalty, it’s clear to me that it was a poison and that the description of the pain actually did something to the .character that warranted the distraction.
But then… these are just my thought processes.
John Layton, how I would deal with the moves is this.
On a Miss, the chemicals taken to gain the benefits of “X Move” have backfired causing an averse effect determined by the MC (in many cases causing Corruption and/or dealing damage.)
I would also remove any Miss’s that only deal faint damage or 1 corruption, unless you are going to replace it with something unique.
I did this with a few Spectre moves.
Tim Franzke, mind looking through the last two Organizations once this series of changes go through?
I will look at it, didn’t have time the last time i went through.
John Layton the thing is that the language of the game fights you. On a 6- means: this happens and not a GM move. You may see this differently but that is how the language works.
Also now you can’t do cool things like:
“I want to use my cool special drugs so i start preparing the herbs. I rolled a 5…”
“Okay so you are nearly done preparing your stuff, just a few things to do before it’s safe and KABOOOM. Your door bursts in and a second granate lands directly before you. You could inject the stuff now but it will have side effects or you have to drop your kit to jump out of the way of the explosion”
All these GM moves are now not possible anymore and the game is poorer because of it. Believe me. Just look at 90% of moves that people wrote. They don’t have a 6- result because what happens is up to the GM.
Those are freaking dangerous psychotics, knowing “puh, i can take a bit of damage” totally defeats the purpose of the danger.
Also, damage isn’t fun or interesting most times. Fictional results are.