Rules question:
So I’m MC-ing a game and one PC had taken the No Rest For the Wicked move (you die but a few hours later you’re resurrected). The PC dies (4 harm) already in their Darkest Self. Their only option to stay alive is burn all their Strings and they don’t want to. So they die. The scene continues with them lying there dead and the other PCs dealing with an NPC. The Dead PC says they want to spend a String to force another PC to have to Hold Steady. I immediately said he couldn’t because a few hours hadn’t passed and he had died seconds ago. The player tried to argue that he could spend this String despite being dead and the conditions of his resurrection move not being met.
Opinions?
Yeah, that’s the downside of Short Rest for the Wicked. You don’t have to go Darkest Self or lose Strings. But you’re also unable to act. If they could find a way to make a memory of a past interaction between the two of them come up that might make them reconsider their course of action, I’d allow it. But unless they could do that, I wouldn’t allow it.
The characters really didn’t have a strong relationship, just some brief interactions, nothing I would say would create strong memories between them.
How exactly is the dead PC taking an action to force the NPC to hold steady? In AW based games you have to take the fictional action to get the mechanical results. Not the other way around. I would say that the dead PC has no memory of, and can’t even perceive any events that happen while they’re dead. Because they’re DEAD.
Christopher Stone-Bush Yeah, I felt as the MC, my statement that he was dead and thus could not do anything was pretty cut and dried…but there was arguing, always something that brings out the best in a gaming session.
Based on the genre, it’s possible for characters to do things while they’re dead. This is a supernatural game after all.
But No Rest For the Wicked can’t just be a “get out of jail free” card. The PC is dead. It’s going to be very difficult for them to take any kind of action. That being said, if the player comes up with some truly inspired way as to how they fictionally take this action, then go right ahead
With all this, there’s a lot of fiction possible ways to bring the character back for a price with magics or shift to a more literal ghost/ ghoul character. Up to the characters now on what’s next or have the person go with a new character.
And silly player not realizing that strings are easy to get back, happy to burn them here if it keeps the character in there.
To expand on the question, can a PC who is not physically there spend a String to affect the other PC? In any case, the player has to describe in the fiction how it works. If he/she/they can’t, then it doesn’t work.
From the text: “Whenever you spend a String, there needs to be something in the fiction to explain the mechanical effect. Remember:
to do it, do it. If you’re subtracting 1 from their next move against you, what’s causing that effect? Do you utter some snide remark that throws them off balance? Or if you’re offering experience for them to do your bidding, what thing in the fiction accounts for that experience point? Do you promise to tell them a juicy secret in return for their obedience?”
This comes across as an active mechanic. Someone who is dead, even albeit temporarily, cannot spend a String because they are not active. The player in my situation has a history of attempting to meta-game and try to come out on top in every situation. When this occurred we were about 10 mins from the end of the campaign, instead of burning his Strings I think he saw No Rest For the Wicked as a get out of jail free card. The worst part was that his wanting to argue about being dead but also wanting to still engage in the mechanics of the story as if he was alive really through a massive bump into wrapping up the game. It reinforces for me as an MC to really hammer home the fiction over the mechanics.
Seth Harris Did the player have any justification (ie. the fiction) on how he could spend the String? Or was he purely arguing from a mechanical standpoint? My questions aren’t a challenge to your ruling. I’m just curious as to the player’s mindset.
He was trying to say the String was the other PCs fear of him I think, but they had barely interacted and the one major interaction involved the still
Iiving PC killing someone so I didn’t feel that the fear made sense. Based on my experiences with this player it was definitely his dissatisfaction when he realized taking No Rest for the Wicked wouldn’t automatically resurrect him. He failed on a roll to turn on and as result I played a hard move where one of his acolytes turned on him in an effort to prove herself to the Dark Power. It was a dramatically appropriate Hard Move and because the story was coming to an end it felt fitting. In previous Monsterhearts games, none that I ran, he has the same problem. Always wants to play the scheming character who gathers Strings and “come out on top”. If he had just burnt all the Strings he collected he would have stayed active in the scene but he definitely thought No Rest would be a tricky way around that.
You can use “Turn someone on” passively (by being attractive near teens), but that’s the only in game move that allows that.
He turned on, failed the roll, so I made the Hard Move. He was alive to turn on. Spending the String was what he wanted to do while dead.
I obviously wasn’t there, but it sounds like the player wasn’t following the spirit of the rules or the game.
I used “Short Rest For The Wicked”in one game(took it as the Werewolf because one of the people playing tried to kill me immediately after I went darkest self and we were starting a new game, and I based it on some werwolf literature where they don’t die permanently(example, Frankenstein vs the Wolfman). Had to wait until next game to continue playing after I died though. Short Rest for The Wicked, while fun, is one of those moves that is slightly cheap(like the Frog Kiss move for the Creature or the Bite move for the Vampire, just kill NPC’s without having to roll.)
Now, as the werewolf, I didn’t use the moves to take stupid risks, just kill and go insane, I treated it more like “Okay, if I die, at least I’m not permanently dead,but the MC could say at any time”Silver or wolfsbane weapons permanently kill you.” and I’ll be okay with that.” In another game, one of our players was the Ghoul and he treated the Ghoul more like the Crow rather than a zombie, just able to walk around, not rotting or anything and we dealt with that, but he just took dying each time and didn’t lose any strings and came back fine each time, so it was a bit too easy for him I felt. So the MC who took over after said “No taking the Ghoul or Short Rest for the Wicked”. Sorry if I sound like I’m ranting, just giving situations I’ve been in.
I’ve just started a game with a Ghoul who has taken Short Rest for the Wicked. It hasn’t really come into play yet, but with him being dead (and having just been ‘withered’ by a Witch I’ll likely be playing the angle of zombies that don’t die, but don’t actually heal either. I mean he’ll get Harm taken away, his internal willpower and the effects of people trying to (erotically) patch him up will keep him going, but at some stage he may just be a head on the ground, or a charred skeleton or something, technically ‘alive’ but unable to do much with his body.
Of course, if the story dictates that changes (he switches Skins or something at the send of the Season, or someone uses some sort of magic to change things) that’s cool. But I don’t see it being a major problem – it’s just a third alternative to Losing All Strings/Becoming Darkest Self to avoid death. Short of the PCs turning on each other I’m not planning on killing the stars of the show off. Not til the climax at least.
In response to the original question though I agree with everyone else. Strings should only be spent if the characters are in an emotional charged situation, face to face, able to get the measure of each other and play on those emotions to their advantage. If the PC was scared of the Ghoul previously he would have a Condition, which could certainly be played upon without the Ghoul being active. But without the fictional world of Monsterhearts I’d say it would rely on either some sort of social engagement or a genre-enforcing Move that would explain how an unconscious/dead character could use a String at a distance.