17 thoughts on “My first attempt at a Cowboy PBTA game.”

  3. I wathced Louis L’Amour’s “Quick and the Dead” last night.

    Duncan McKaskel

    High Concept: Teacher with ideals shaped by his survival of Gettysburg.

    History: Worked for the Underground Railroad in Pennsylvania. Decorated War Hero. Pacifist because of it. 

    Issue: Pacifism is dangerous on the frontier where there is no law.

    Treasure: His wife and child.

    Con Vallain

    High Concept: Drifter with a need for vengeance.

    History: Half breed raised by his white father. His Blackfoot mother and family was recently murdered by another half breed. 

    Issue: Women (Which would include Susanna McKaskel)

    Treasure: His freedom

    (The name is funny: Too close to “Con Villain” to be a coincidence. I wonder why L’Amour chose it since the guy is not a villain at all)

  10. OK this is to be added to the GM Principles (From another thread on subtext)

    ☺ Don’t say it straight – give them clues and make them figure it out.

  12. Alfred Rudzki Some of the most memorable RPG sessions I played in there was some sort of mystery that had to be solved. Some of the best boardgames have incomplete player information – and games with traitor mechanics are some of the best. Also story theorists tell us that stories wiyh complete information are simply poor stories.

    That is why I think it may be a good principle.

    Why would you disagree?

  13. 1) Genre Emulation. I’m not saying that there aren’t Mystery Westerns (after all the Western is Noir’s grandpa), but to give your cowboy game a principle saying make the game a mystery runs — in my vision — counter to what a western should be. In westerns, nobody is scrounging around desperate for clues in any real way. There’s rarely bits and pieces and bobs dropping in because the characters are scrounging bookshelves and notepads… the mystery is just handed to them.

    Good Bad and Ugly nobody is desperately seeking the location of the gold. That just gets handed out in pieces by the GM while they do other stuff.

    Once Upon a Time in the West nobody is cross-referencing train schedules with business records to realize that Sweetwater is the result of a deal with the train company. No, Harmonica just shows up and says “hey here’s the plot” because the MC handed it out.

    Mysteries are fine, wee they’re fun, I think we’ve all enjoyed them. Having fun, memorable mysteries in other games has nothing to do with making your western game a Western game.

    2) Incomplete player information is great for a boardgame where we’re trying to strategically model optimal choice-making through pattern recognition or deductive reasoning (deductive, right? I always forget which is deductive). This is great for board games because board games have a competitive elements — vs other players or vs the board.

    This isn’t a board game you’re making, right? This is an RPG. This is an RPG powered by the apocalypse, right? So, I don’t see any reason to make one of your principles “don’t tell players everything” when *W games are pretty clear about open and honest discourse between the MC and the players. Again, hey, if this were a Mystery game like Tremulus or Monster of the Week I don’t think I’d be adverse to the idea… but it’s not! And it’s not a board game, so your comment doesn’t really follow.

    3) Good for the story theorists, but I don’t think that matters. Basically, you don’t need a principle for “make mysteries.” You can just make them, if you want them. That’s fine. But seriously, again, I don’t think the guiding principle that an MC looks to when they’re not sure what to say in a Western game should be “don’t tell them everything, make them figure it out.”

    I’m not saying it’s a bad principle — I personally feel it’s an off-genre principle.

    I will however openly admit that I am also biased from reading Baker’s Dogs in the Vineyard. In it (I don’t know if you’ve read it; for everybody else I’ll just say it anyway) Vincent talks about playing your mysteries openly — basically, nobody wants to muck around mindlessly for four hours trying to figure out what’s going on. Nah, get the details out there, force the players to make dramatic choices, get the ball rolling.

    In my opinion, my viewing experience, and my preference: Westerns aren’t about mystery solving. You might solve a mystery in a Western, but the mystery is more of a pacing device on all the other action that is taking place.

    Your mileage (and western preferences!!) may vary 🙂

  14. Alfred Rudzki Ok I don’t communicate very well. When I talk about mysteries I dont mean Poirrot and Marple.

    Mystery solving in westerns.

    Magnificent 7: Why does the guy who is scared of his own shadow join the team?

    Shalako: Why does a drifter quote classical writers?

    Crossfire Trail: Whats with the guy who is dating the bereaved widow?

    Lone Ranger: What is Johnny Depp’s characters motivation?

    Shane: Why does the wife react to shane the way she does?

    These are all interesting questions that the stories ask. The writers don’t answer them directly but provide clues and small scraps of information until all is revealed as act three is entered.

    I meant that sort of mystery.

  15. As for boardgames and RPG’s there is serious cross pollination. Battlestar Galactica and The Resistance are classic traitor games that have strong story elements. Magic Realm shamelessly emulates DnD. As does Descent. There are games that blur the genre line even more. Why does a game that uses cards qualify as a board game (Werewolf) but a game that uses books not (Murderous ghosts)? What is the difference between a Magic card and a PbtA move?

    If you play AW and you do not know what a character’s motives are you read a person. Yet the MC could do the same in the fiction: give the PC clues. X was supposed to deliver fuel, but did not. Why? There could be ten reasons of which only one one can be legit. Can he still be trusted? Play to find out. What do you do?

    So now the players have to make tactical decision based on incomplete information. Exactly like in a board game.

    I believe that basing decisions on incomplete information is much more interesting than basing decisions on complete information. That is basic game theory.

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