Second Skins came out the other day, and I’m still sort of parsing everything in the 1st wave download.
Ross Cowman or others; what’s the elevator pitch for why one would want to use the Crabby Edition basic moves? What is the philosophy that makes them different than the original basic moves, or are they just different for difference sake? (I’m definitely intrigued. 😀 Just trying to wrap my head around them.)
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WAIT! It’s OUT! WHERE CAN I GET IT?!
The PDFs were sent out to kickstarter backers yesterday. Not sure where you get it if you weren’t a backer.
I missed backing it too. So waiting with anticipation
I’m interested in the answer. 🙂
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I think they are overall better, w/ a couple weak points.
The first one is Lash Out Physically’s “scarring” and “frightening or horrifying” options. These are 10+ options, and they need to provide tangible benefits. I think the Scarring one should definitely inflict a condition. I’m not entirely sure about the frightening or horrifying one; perhaps it should also inflict a condition on someone present(such as Terrified, though the specific condition might be at the MC’s discretion), but the GM gets to determine who’s the most scared there and thus the one who receives it? Or perhaps something else, though I personally am having trouble thinking of a better option.
On a side note, I really like the removal of the “Take a string” option from the default Lash Out Physically move. I don’t think it makes sense for all characters, and this change also makes the Primal Dominance move from the Werewolf skin more poignant — it now truly says something about the person who takes it; its effect now cannot be duplicated(more or less) by characters without the move.
Gaze Into the Abyss — Ever since seeing McDaldno explain the intent behind this move on the Story Games forum, complete with examples such as the “Google Montage” and someone riding their motorcycle through the woods to clear their head and piece things together, I’ve been dissatisfied with the way the move is actually written(or at least I wish that McDaldno had actually left the examples in the final text, as he stated that such examples were in the original playtest document). And, if anything, I think this new one’s wording takes it even further from the original authorial intent. Also, removing the “carry 1 forward” from the “the visions show you what you must do” choice makes it a bad choice. To be honest, lucid & detailed is already going to give you a pretty good idea of what action to take next; the reason you choose “show you what you must do” was to also get a tangible bonus to acting on the information. I would like to see the following:
–Somehow include “state what you are doing in pursuit of the information” in the trigger. Such as “When you gaze into the abyss, state what you are doing in pursuit of the information and roll with dark.”
–Roll “must do” and “must know” into one, as they are functionally identical. I can’t think of any reason to present them as two different things. They both represent you getting some specific information that it would be in your best interest to act on.
–Put back the “carry 1 forward” in the above choice.
–Add something, as with the Hold Steady option that also removes conditions, to that choice that requires the player to explain just how their little vision quest is addressing their condition. Perhaps “something happens to address one of your Conditions during your search for information, tell us what and remove a Condition.”
Other than the Gaze Into the Abyss move’s changes and that one part of the Lash Out Physically move, I think the rest of the moves(including the other 75% of the Lash Out Physically one) are overall better than the originals, and that they show a good deal of thought and reflection on the game by someone who’s probably played it quite a bit over the last few years. The changes in Turn Someone On, Shut Someone Down, and Hold Steady are all brilliant, and while it’s only a small adjustment, the addition of “leave something behind” to the Run Away options is also really awesome. Seriously, those 4 modified moves are inspired.
Derek Cardwell Okay, you’ve sold me on the removal of strings from Lashing Out. I thought that this had to be in there for people to be able to play ‘bully’ characters, but they can just take the Primal Dominance move from the Werewolf skin if they want to play that kind of character.
I think ‘scarring’ though needs to be something done with the permission of the character’s player.
I like the new Turn On, Shut Down, Run Away, though Hold Steady has been buffed a fair bit (I found the old 7-9 result a little dull), so much so that I’m going to watch out for any high Cold character using it to ‘grind’ XP.
Abyss has always caused problems. I like your approach to it.
Richard Williams 2 forward might be a bit much, though they are only applicable to a particular situation unlike strings. But otherwise I don’t really see a problem. The player doesn’t call when they make a particular move; that’s the GM’s call. So if there isn’t anything particularly stressful/scary in the scene, or their “what’s the worst that could happen” explanation is weak, I’d just disallow the roll.
Sure, in most games, we kind of bend this for certain moves that are obvious. Or at the very least allow the player to suggest a particular move they think is applicable since keeping up with everyone’s skin moves can be a bit daunting, especially after a few advances. But it’s always understood that if the rationale is weak, the GM can ask for more information — “I don’t see it. Why do you think this is applicable?” or “But what is your character actually doing?” — and deny the Move if such info isn’t forthcoming.
Rob Deobald I guess a part of an answer to your OP is that they move all the basic string acquisition into Turn On and Shut Down (removing it from Lash Out and Run Away), which makes sense as they’re the more social moves. So that looks like a core philosophical choice.
One of the biggest issues with Shut Someone Down in my book was always the name. Players struggled to understand exactly when it should be triggered and what the result should be. I half-expected this revision to change the name, but instead they changed the effects to better reflect what people thought the name was. Now when you ‘shut someone down’ they’re either going to apologise or their going to end the conversation. So I think the big changes there are more to remedy that particular problem.
Richard Williams Yes, that’s exactly what I found the most brilliant about the changes to Turn On and Shut Down! If you succeed, either something interesting happens, or the conversation with that particular person comes to an end(w/ you getting a string, or the other person getting the string on SD 7-9). That is so awesome!
Rob Deobald I think these moves do a couple of things:
they shift the focus slightly from mechanical results (that we interpret into story or feed into another mechanical system like a move or strings) to results that change your characters status or position in the fiction.
Second they promote short punchy tv-drama style scenes that focus on the relationship between a pair (or PC NPC triangle) of characters.
also note that Hypnotism and Cold as Ice need some tweaking to work with these moves. (possibly others as well?)