Howdy.
I’m currently getting a game of US together, and can’t wait to play.
I do have a question on the Wolf. His Corruption reads: “When you begin the hunt for someone, mark Corruption.”
The Bloodhound move reads: “When you hunt someone…”
Am I correct to assume the Corruption move is fed by the Bloodhound?
If so, seems a little harsh, compared to the other playbooks. As if being penalized for using the Wolf’s character move.
The Vamp is corrupted when they feed, the Veteran is corrupted when they go into danger. By contrast, the Wolf is tame, because they don’t need to hunt.
Don’t think of corruption as a penalty. It is a thing that makes the game fun and interesting.
This is a penalty, because this results in character changing in a specific direction you may not want him to and eventually being unplayable. The fact that it can be fun and interesting is as relevant as a fact that handcuffs can be used in a healthy relationship – it happens, but it isn’t for everyone
The Vamp’s corruption is triggered if he feeds on someone unwilling – meaning the fun could be seducing mortals to give themselves to you. And the Veteran can hold back to avoid triggering his corruption, but he can still help out and run tactical support with Best Laid Plans.
And I’m not really complaining about the Wolf’s corruption – I get it, and I think it’s cool. It would also count as hunting if you’re hitting the streets, looking to find and kill the vampire pimp.
But I’m wondering why Bloodhound is for hunting only, and incur corruption just by its use. All the other playbook move’s the PC can take corruption as a mechanic for enhancing the power, or if they fail fail. Wouldn’t it make more sense to word Bloodhound as if “when you want to track someone” ? It would make the move more utilitarian, and up to the fiction whether it’s used for hunting, or finding where your buddy went, for example.
I’m sure you could make a custom move for that and it wouldn’t spoil anything.
But to your point of “other moves don’t induce corruption” fairy magic does as a cost (you have a choice, but it’s still there).
Yes, I was meaning things like the Fae as well – it’s optional to take corruption with use of its power. Wizard’s channeling too. shrug
But no option like that for Bloodhound.
I have an answer, but I think you’ll find it unsatisfying.
The answer is that, on a 7+ roll, Bloodhound allows the player to shortcut what might be a difficult endeavor, and the Wolf starts with it. The only power that surpasses it in providing information that would otherwise require more work to get is the Oracle’s corruption move I, All-Seeing, and that requires corruption AND a point of harm.
Bloodhound comes into play only when the player or his friends need to find someone who isn’t immediately easy to find, and continues until that person is found, which I would read as “a situation where the Wolf can make a roll directly affecting the target of the hunt,” not just “seeing the quarry across a crowded football stadium before he/she slips behind a column, lost again.”
This information would be, in my view as an MC, the kind of thing that, in the absence of Bloodhound, might take much of a session to roleplay.
Example: a Hunter is trying to find a vampire. She Hits the Streets, locating one of the vampire’s friends to lean on, but then needs to either get a debt or win a Persuade roll to get the actual information of where the target is. When the Hunter gets to the outside of the vampire’s nest, there are guards that need to be taken care of, and in the ensuing commotion, the vampire flees. The Hunter needs to start again.
With Bloodhound, the Wolf needs one successful roll. No debts, no second roll to coax the information out of a source. And, under my reading, the hunt doesn’t end until the Wolf can interact directly with the quarry, so, in my example above where the guards delay the character so the vampire can escape, the Wolf can pursue immediately, or even spend time recuperating from wounds, and be able to track the quarry down later — the quarry has not yet been found, so the duration of the Bloodhound power has not expired.
Like any ability to “shortcut” debts and roleplaying in Urban Shadows, this power costs corruption.
Now, if you don’t find Bloodhound as useful as I do, then this isn’t a satisfying answer. But it’s the one I have.
Another point: You gain corruption when you start a hunt, but Bloodhound can be used many times during a hunt.
I’m curious if anyone understands my view of this? I understand it’s harder to change something if it already exists…
Aaron, why would one need to use the move a second time? They already know exactly how to find them. 😛
Benjamin, That’s great that Bloodhound can unerringly track someone. It could be game breaking, but all the playbook moves are. Should be. As the MC, I encourage the players to be as powerful as they can – it means I can do more to them as the MC.
A few other playbook moves can teleport the player. The Tainted can, if he’s got a debt – or someone can teleport him. That seems fairly powerful. Means the Tainted doesn’t even have to cross the crowded football stadium.
The player’s intent should dictate whether he’s using Bloodhound to hunt. Or it could be to find his friends, or some other VIP. If the Wolf wants to kill them at the end of it, then that’s a hunt. It could also be considered a hunt depending on how the Wolf uses Hitting the Streets, or Letting it Out. A move shouldn’t automatically infer your intent.
Likewise, if Bloodhound leads the Wolf to his quarry, he still has to get to physically get to him. There will be opportunities to get by the quarry’s guards, or break into the tenement, or make a pact with the fae king, or expose himself to some sort of trouble, or sneak by someone. Bloodhound can still take a session to play.
I made a playbook I called the Tribal, for AW. I gave him a tracking power. I would modify it for more the Wolf’s style.
Something like this:
When you track someone, roll Blood. On a hit, you know exactly how to find them, and can follow their scent until you do. On a 10+, choose 1, on a 7-9, choose 2, on a fail you still find it, but choose 3.
-The quarry is in some very hostile company. (to you)
-You have to get past a physical obstruction.
-You have to pass through the territory of someone powerful and unfriendly.
-You reach their general vicinity, but the quarry’s scent disappears somewhere in the area.
-You can’t go back the same way you came.
-You miss something important.
-You’re exhausted, take -1 whenever you next interact directly with the quarry.
-The quarry is far, far away.
-The quarry is not what you expected.
Something like that. Tweak the wording, or options.
But any one of those options sounds fun. And it doesn’t infer the intent. But if the Wolf uses this move to “hunt” (aka mess up), take Corruption. (and the MC should ask)
Anywho.
To those that have kept following this thread, I apologize for clinging to this for so long. 😛
(and Andrew Medeiros, Mark Diaz Truman, feel free to use my move for your next edition) 😉
Colin Campbell I’m not sure what you mean about “intent” for the Wolf’s hunt.
The Hunter archetype’s “on a hunt” specifically requires being armed and looking for a particular target. I wouldn’t apply this definition to the Wolf, because the Wolf doesn’t need to be transformed or armed to “declare a hunt.” So I wouldn’t read an intention for murderous violence.
I understand a hunt to be when a Wolf uses his/her inner wolf to track someone. That could be to eat them, to harry them out of his/her territory, to give them a message, or just to play tag. The key parts of the hunt are (A) needing to find someone, and (B) doing so through one’s innate werewolf-ness, not through a method another archetype could use.
So, under my reading, if a Hunter and a Wolf are looking for a demon, and they’re packing heat and kicking in doors to interrogate the demon’s contacts, the Hunter is on a hunt. The Wolf is not. The Wolf isn’t on a hunt until the Wolf chooses to be (or must declare one due to operation of the rules), at which point Bloodhound becomes viable.
The other part where I think we differ about Bloodhound is that
we should discuss what it means when the move says, “On a hit, you know exactly where to find them and can follow their scent until you do.”
I read that as the Wolf gains knowledge of the exact location of the target before the Wolf actually gets anywhere near the target; that the wolf knows where the target is before choosing to “follow the scent.” With foreknowledge, the Wolf can anticipate some of the difficulties and dangers.
Benjamin Cooper
Our definition of “hunt” is perfectly aligned.
I’m referring to the “trigger” of the move, which is only do-able if the character “hunts.” But what if the Wolf wants to find someone, without hunting them? Why would his tracking/finding ability not work anymore? He’s a friggin werewolf with supernatural senses – let him.
I’m arguing to broaden what triggers the move.
Instead of the trigger being “you hunt,” make the trigger something like “you track.” Then let the Wolf gain corruption – or not – based on why he is using Bloodhound in the established fiction. Is the Wolf’s intent to use the move to find and kill someone? (gain corruption) Or does he use it to rescue a kidnapped child, say?
Further elaboration, the move Hitting the Streets has a broad trigger. It can be used to find someone, albeit with different means than Bloodhound. But if the Wolf is using HtS to find someone with the intent to ruin them, he gains corruption. If he wants to find a hookup, no corruption.
Point being, the trigger of the move should be broadened. Let the PC use it however he wants, as long as it makes sense in the fiction. And then follow the story of the Wolf on the trail.
Colin Campbell I see no problem with a wolf tracking someone via Let It Out if you want that. It would just be imperfect information.
To your point on corruption and saving a child – the archetype corruption is not about “being evil”. It is about a choice between things – in the wolf’s case that choice is humanity or his beast. When you use Bloodhound you are choosing the beast.