We are currently working on a Science Fiction RPG using the PbtA system. The game is about ex-military criminals taken from death row and placed in a penal regiment where they are sent on the worse missions in the universe.
Our question to the community is, what would you like to see from a Science Fiction PbtA game, we are at the point where we can change/adapt the rules before we release in January.
So please share your thoughts.
Thanks
I want to know if I am going the Space Opera route, or Hard Science, or anything in between. Better yet, give me tools (if possible) to define this during craation.
The game is very much a Space Opera with influences like Firefly, The Dirty Dozen, Aliens etc
No influence from stuff like The Expanse or Total Recall? Both could suits you, from some angles.
Anyway, what I meant (I am unsure whether I was clear) was to define exactly what kind of scifi I would be playing (and your answer is useful, thanks).
Hi FGI folks! I am interested in this, especially from a 12 Monkeys and The Expanse standpoint. I enthusiastically encourage you to design the heck out of your game, especially if you are planning to release it in a month. If this release date is for a playtest draft or ashcan or other first look “give us feedback” deal, awesome, good, carry on!
However!! If it’s for a kickstarter, print run, or sale, y’all need to figure out what your game is and write that. What’s your insight into space opera, what’s your insight into game design, what’s your insight into human experience- write that! Who am I in your game (a convict) and what do I do (whatever dangerous thing they offer so I can?? Shorten my sentence/make some cash/get out for even a bit?)
Inviting co-designers to suggest changes and adaptations to unseen rules is a step on to really frustrating ground. Too many cooks, herding cats, trying to make everyone happy and therefore making nobody happy; all that.
Your loving MB
What sort of play experience are you looking to create? Desperate struggle with a high chance of death, badass heroics, an exploration of the tragedy of prisoners being forced to fight, etc?
The game is very much a action RPG with ex-criminals fighting to stay away from death row. Currently we have rules for 5 Playbooks, cybernetics, space flight and combat, vehicles etc. We also have rules that allow your characters brain to be removed upon death and placed in a cyborg, allowing the player to effectively continue playing once they have built their Body.
The game is a bit tongue in cheek and has already been released in the D20 version, the Kickstarter we ran was funded and the Death Row edition is the PbtA version of the game and the main focus of the kickstarter.
There is also going to be a SW version released later this month which is being produced by someone else.
here is some artwork from the game (as you can see not the typical B&W of some PbtA games)
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/b1OZ3TBZV_VaZNdy_YU7B0P5MPC5JquOeayQamFB94r8okhEInF2EKFIL8CwCcB5BSauK_3UnhzpsXYjMh18Z02oCsBoLyvKe3w=s0
and some more art
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/VntofhDMIqCtNnQYZfjdABtd30UTB93TgzZJ4bZKJi21vG2X26amNDjxgG2QfIiVxrU6YoyaqdpUBgLHDs8yq9Nb_t–dU4cpzE=s0
OK, cool, so combat is a big focus. A lot of PbtAs resolve combat in a couple of moves, but I’d assume it has a higher resolution in your game. What sort of flow does your basic moves create? Do they encourage characters sniping carefully, and using cover, charging in guns blazing, working as a coordinated team, etc?
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Yes, there are basic moves, player moves and combat moves. depending on the character will determine which character moves they have but sniping etc is a thing, also assault rules for squads is included.
We have a thing called Giga-Voodoo in the game that allow ‘Witches’ to consciously interact with computers and machines, psychic hacking sort of, where they will face defense in cyberspace that appear as wolves etc. Also this would mean they could transfer to a cyber eye of a guard and see what they see, then hop to a nearby security cam.
So there are a lot of aspects to the game, and you can even play the game as a civilian and just Merc or smuggle your way around the galaxy, Firefly style.
I imagine moves to manipulate (and be victimized by) prison bureaucracy or interact with (and be victimized by) police figures or establish social dominance through sudden/definitive violence (etc) work great for the “Riddicks” of the game —with great choices on 7-9s — but I don’t see those same choices, if focused on your subject, serving run of the mill space-citizens. But maybe I’m just not seeing it!
How do your moves serve the cool but niche focus of “prisoners kicking ass to stay alive” while simultaneously serving the more broad realities of everyday civilians or mercenaries?
The galaxy is a harsh place and Humans are seen as interlopers and disliked by the aliens, so its just as harsh for normal human space citizens.
You know this is the plot of StarCraft, right?
To be clear: I’m not asking about moves to represent space being harsh or aliens being terrible, I’m asking about how your Moves approach and interact with the broken power dynamics of a prison-slave-suicide-execution system, and how non-Lifer space citizens with no experience in those broken power dynamics can use those same Moves.
If the answer is “We didn’t design moves to represent living in a broken prison system,” that’s a valid answer.
I feel like Morningstar already wrote this and its called Durance.
But then, he’s done everything.
Sounds a bit like “A-Team in Space”. (At least the 5th season where they were trying to “earn their freedom” by completing a certain number of missions for a secret branch of the military.)
Which would be awesome.
Alfred Rudzki Yeah the games not about living in a prison system at all.
Tim Osburn Yeah pretty much sums it up except you still work for human government.
William Nichols We started writing the original game 20 years ago and Durance is about colonies, rather than a Galaxy with hundreds of star systems, but I recognise the similiarity.
Tony Scinta III Well they are both sci-fi military games, I guess.
Tarrens are criminals that were shot off into space because they couldn’t be trusted in earth-human society.
Hence the rebel flag on the side of all their ships.
Tony Scinta III never played it, i don’t tend to play games on PC. I have heard of it though from years back.
FeralGamersInc RPG Ok. How many iterations has it gone through in the past 20 years? And are you rewriting the concepts and doing the design work for each game design system you explore, or is the d20 game basically the same as the SW game and the PBtA game will be basically that as well? Also, how is this different from your d20 game Zombie Squad that’s currently up on Drive-Thru?
The original was percentile, but we left it a long while and then I wrote a basic PbtA version which worked well during testing. So the premise will be the same as will the artwork, obviously the rules will be different, which includes new stats, moves, combat rules, damage and harm etc.
Outside of a “do something when things are hard and no other move applies,” and a “do violence” move or two, what sorts of activities/beats do you have Moves for?
Jury rigging, social moves, parkour, vehicle use, giga-voodoo moves. We also have a large selection of tags that player get from previous careers.
well, arent we talking about this?
kickstarter.com – The Zombie Squad
What PbtA games are you taking as your primary influences on how you design a PbtA game with this premise?
Also, if your kickstarter has already funded, why are you still at “what does the community want from a Sci-Fi PbtA game?” It’s tough to give good ETA for fulfillment on design work you haven’t yet done.
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There is a director’s cut version already in the drivethru, no?!
Yeah the D20 version is available on DTRPG.
Meguey Baker The game is almost done, but we thought as we are in the process we would ask the community if there was anything in particular they would like to see. In a way to discover if we had ticked all the boxes and whether there was any more boxes we could tick.
As influences we have checked out The Sprawl, Apocalypse World, Uncharted Worlds and a few free Hacks by John Harper, regiment to name one.
FeralGamersInc RPG gotcha.
FeralGamersInc RPG If you haven’t read Alien Legion (comic book series), I’d recommend it here. I’m curious how you’ll balance the conceit of the genre that the teams are sent on missions they have little to no say in with the sensibilities of the PbtA games where players are in control of much of the development of the game and the plotline?
Because doing the missions is better than the firing squad. Once they get over that part they can approach the missions in anyway they choose, they are deniable.
FeralGamersInc RPG So where in that premise do our PCs come in? How does the game start? Because if the game starts with me having to choose between a death sentence and a suicide mission, and I am a player with AW-style agency and moves and input into the world and what happens, you can bet your last bootstrap I’m going to be looking for some other options!!
If the game starts with “Ok, so you are the scum that chose this mission instead of the firing line. You’re on a crappy scout ship going to a terrible job with only the thinnest chance of getting back to your cozy 3×5 and waiting for your number to come up again. Why’d you take it? What’ve you got left worth fighting for?” then maybe you skip the part where I’m pushing hard for a third option on the prison station, and instead I’m pushing hard to seize control of the current situation and get the hell out.
Absolutely, Meguey Baker. I cannot +1 this enough.
If the setup s we’re starship troopering down into Klendathu to fight some bugs? Bugger that. I’m setting up a hardhold, my own government, and living off the land. If they want me back, they can fight through the bugs that now protect me.
I guess what it comes down to is this: how is my PC a capable person with agency and some scrap of decency worth saving? Unless you are very up front with “you play hardened criminals in their final “nothing left to lose” careen into the sun, because at least they get to choose how they die”, your premise seems very far indeed from the source materials mentioned such as Firefly and Aliens and such.
The thing I known most about your gave design in this so far is that “giga-voodoo” is a thing*. If you give me a PC decker of some sort that can somehow psychically interact with and hack machinery including the cybernetics of the guards!?!? Oh, I am going nowhere I don’t wanna go, and that’s for damn sure!**
*Setting aside that the name is a curious choice.
**Dice roles permitting, natch.
The game can be played how you want it to be, you can ignore the criminal element completely and treat it as a sci-fi game where you play mercs, smugglers or transporters, like Firefly, or as hardened marine types with a criminal past and all the benefits that brings like contacts, tags etc. Except now you are being equipped by the military.
How the missions are approached is up to the players, if they continue to break laws or mess with the fine diplomatic balance of the galaxy, they will end up back on death row awaiting there sentence.
Unlike a lot of PbtA games the characters do have backgrounds, and past careers which establish starting Tags, the players starting stats choices, previous events and contacts and starting gear.
The name the Zombie Squad comes from the fact the squads are taken from Death Row and are considered walking Dead.
”You are an ex-military prisoner, yanked from your cold stone cell on death row and offered the choice to die by firing squad or die redeeming yourself for the good of humanity. “
Ok, that’s 12 Monkeys or the like. Redemption, desperation, how do I balance my life vs. my soul/peace of mind/legacy, all that. Cool.
”You play mercs, smugglers or transporters [with various] contacts, tags etc. Except now you are being equipped by the military. If you continue to break laws or mess with the fine diplomatic balance of the galaxy, you will end up on death row awaiting your sentence.”
Ok, that’s possibly Firefly or The Expanse or the like. Walk the razors edge, space pirates, stick it to the Man, how do I find freedom, what really matters, what will I do or sacrifice to stay safe, all that. Cool.
Do you see how those are different games? Designing to encompass both those is not easy, especially if you are set on your premise of “you are on death row and forced to go on a suicide run, but maybe you are a martial arts adept or a super hacker or a gunslinger.”
The essential question in AW is “what will you make of this shit world?”
The essential question in Monsterhearts is (I think) “ what makes you human and how do you embrace your humanity?”
The essential question in Blades in the Dark is “what are you willing to put yourself through to get what you want?”
What is the essential question in Zombie Squad?
How will you use the opportunity of a second chance to survive a hostile galaxy, get what you want and redeem your past crimes whilst avoiding the chance that you could be sent back to death row at any time. (Military)
Or
What will you do to survive a hostile galaxy, make a fast buck and increase your reputation whilst avoiding the authorities. (Firefly)
So still two parallel game designs then?
A possible way forward:
“You have a second chance. Do you use it to make a fast buck or to redeem yourself?”
Then you design toward that, giving your players, regardless of what PC they choose or how they help build the world, continual opportunity and pressure to answer that question.
Ok, since you asked in your OP what we’d like to see in a Sci-FI game, I think I’ve answered you to the best of my ability. Hopefully some of it helps! You are still on a wicked tight timeline to deliver on this in a month. Good luck!
Thanks for the advice, the game is mostly finished so its all good.