The problem with custom Monsterhearts skins is when they start with a monster and then retrofit a teenage problem into it. Start with the problem and then find a monster that fits that theme. Right? Wrong?
Alberto Muti
The problem with custom Monsterhearts skins is when they start with a monster and then retrofit a teenage problem…
The problem with custom Monsterhearts skins is when they start with a monster and then retrofit a teenage problem…
Mostly right. If you focus purely on the monster, I feel you’ve missed the point. But if you start with a monster, then figure out what teenage problem it could represent and build along those lines, I think it can work.
That’s what I did with the Oni and the Kitsune. I had to go back to the drawing board a few times though, because I was focusing too much on the monster and not the aspect of teenage life they represented.
I think starting from the monster can work just as fine, as long as the focus is kept tightly on teenage behaviour. I’ve seen a few skins that had a lot of moves that just were cool monster superpowers. That won’t fly.
I haven’t read the Kitsune, but I remember the Oni being very focused on social behaviour, which worked quite well.
Not to make the thread about me, but I got lucky with the Oni. The “real” monster has become a character to enforce social rules and “harmony” through threats and bullying, which was an unexplored space in Monsterhearts. I struggled with the next few skins (and am still struggling with the Tengu) as they were too much monster and not enough teenager.
I really like the Oni by the way.
Concerning new skins I always want to do as little as possible. When what you are creating deals with the same stuff then the werewolf, why not use it? People get hung up on the names a lot I think. You can do quite a lot of concepts with changing maybe 1-2 moves and adjusting the darkest self or sex move. That might not be as satisfying as. Resting a whole new thing but I’d rather have less work. Now I don’t k ow what the Tengu or Kitsune are majorly about in their respective mythologies and so I can’t really extrapolate from that but from what I know the Kitsune seems closeish to the Fey in a lot ways, just with a heavier obsession with tails.
Dunno if you want to examine specific Skins or if you want to keep things general Tim Franzke. I’ll follow your lead, as you’re the OP.
That was more like a second mini rant
Christopher, I think that talking about actual experience in designing a skin is a pretty good way to have this conversation!
The only skin I’ve completed is not actually based on a monster archetype, so I didn’t really run that risk. I have a couple others, lying around half-written, and with those I think i’ve done a fairly good job of staying focused on behaviour rather than superpowers.
Tim Franzke, I disagree on ‘importing’ moves. It could work, I guess, I think that exploring new ways to approach a particular concept through move design is good, so if there’s overlap between some of the themes my skin touches on, and themes that are already touched by other skins, if I can I’ll design moves that show how this character deals with that issue. The Ghoul and the Werewolf have both issues with self-control and violence, but they do that in a very distinctive way. The Oni approaches Violence, too, but in another way altogether. The Skin I’ve completed, the candle, has a move about outbursts of violence, but it’s different again.
Of course, it’s a different issue if all the themes under your skin are already covered solidly by another… but then again, someone might have a new creative way to address those in mind, so why not do it. If it really doesn’t add anything, people won’t play with it.
Yeah… I get that.
I know for a fact that other people have made Kitsune and Tengu Skins besides me, both before and after. I agree with Alberto Muti that different people will have different interpretations of the same thing. If you’re doing a Skin on a monster that’s already been done, I think that just means you might have to work harder to find that unexplored angle.
My first draft of the Kitsune was just the monster; not an aspect of teenage life turned into a monster. As such, it wasn’t very good. I had to step back and really think about what this monster represented and how that would apply to teenage life. I finally hit upon the idea that the Kitsune is a perpetual liar. They sort of have to be, as they take other people’s shape.
That dovetailed nicely with being a teenager. Everyone knows that kid who, for whatever reason, simply will not or can not tell the truth regardless of how much trouble it causes. Maybe they lie to be cool or to fit in, maybe they’re embarrassed or ashamed of who they really are, maybe they’re just bored and lying is more fun than telling the truth, or maybe they’re in too deep and have to keep lying to keep everything from crashing down around them.
So that’s where I took it. My Kitsune Skin became less about being the mythical, shape-changing fox spirit, and more about being a pathological liar. I dropped moves that only supported the monster and (hopefully) kept moves that supported the liar aspect.
Getting things back on track though, I have seen some Skins that made me think “this is just the monster”, which, again I feel misses the point. To be fair though, it took someone else pointing out my skin was just the monster for me to see it.
Personally I think now between the stock & created skins that it offers quite a lot for players so I say just pick an existing one then customize their life.
I think both approaches can lead to a good skin. You just got to have a good match of monster and teenager archetype and the reader in the end should not notice that one was compromised to fit the other.
The other way is a problem too, IMO. If your Teen Problem Dude isn’t also a resonant monster archetype, it falls really flat, at least to me. The Queen is about as far as I feel comfortable going in that direction, and even then only because you at least have the option of making her a hivemind.
What about the Mortal Topher Gerkey?
Marilyn Munster gets grandfathered in. But we don’t need a whole bunch of Marilyns! One will do. ^_^
I made mine before actually playing Monsterhearts, and I think it shows. Now that I’m playing my second official skin, in the third season of our home game, I think I’m much better suited for a re-write.
The Shadow was about problematic relationships before it was about spooky imaginary friends! It’s just mechanically clunky and thematically heavy-handed!
Yeah, another thing I have been doubtful about, in all honesty, is how much playtest some skins have received. Sometimes I’ve just read something (not necessarily on this group), and thought ‘mmh… has this ever seen playtest?’
I’m erring a bit on the other side here, as my skin has been playtested once in a full – and very long – season, and once in a one-shot game (both times with me present at the table, but played by somebody else and with me trying not to explain how things should work), and I still am not sure it’s fit for release to the public.
What if you take a normal skin and add a word in front of it? Just spitballing here, but how about the Hot Werewolf
Isn’t the Werewolf pretty Hot to beginn with?
No but this is a Hot, Werewolf
Also 90% of the moves are to emulate the Werewolf from Hotel Transylvania but this is intentional
Christopher Stone-Bush I really like the Oni. It’s actually one of the very few custom skins I’d allow in one of my games. I’d love to talk Monsterhearts sometime.
I’ve been working on a couple skins with a friend, and I find it’s a bit of a mix – I connect a teenage thing and a monster in my head, find that essential thing and it all comes from there.
Thanks Shoe Skogen. I’m really flattered that the Oni is one of the few custom Skins you allow at your table.
The Monsterhearts community here was invaluable for its feedback and critique. Post those Skins up! I’d love to see them.
Very right